EngineerLife

Hi. I just bought a Tamiya Plasma Edge II a few weeks ago. I assembled the kit and drove it around a little bit, and was curious to see how fast it went. To see how fast it went, I put my cell phone with the app SpeedTracker inside the car, and drove around the car. It only went a max speed of 10mph, so I then looked into how to upgrade its speed. I read online about gear ratios, transmission ratios, final drive ratios, and how to apply this to if you are overstressing your motor or not using it to its max potential. I found that the gear ratios were fine, and the only other thing that I could think of to increase it's speed is to upgrade the motor. Now, I am new to rc cars, for I have been driving the ones that you buy for little kids at the store for 20$ from when I was 6 to about 12 years old, but now that I am older, I looked into building a hobby RC car and the Tamiya Plasma Edge is the car that I have built for my first build. I am very new to all the little mechanics and terms used in hobby RC cars, so sorry if I don't fully understand some of the RC car mechanics and terms. I looked into the Flash Racing Motor 1/10 sensored motor 5.5 turns 6800kv motor, since I want it to still have strength to drive on other surfaces besides a road (hence why I got a buggy and not a normal car ), but I want it to still have more speed than it currently does. I am thinking on getting to recommended ESC which is the Toro TS 120A ESC, but I don't know what battery I would need. It say that it can have a max battery of a 9 cell NIMH battery, or a 3S LIPO battery. Do I go safe and go with the 9 cell NIMH battery or go with a LIPO battery? I'm worried that I may accidentally during driving the car puncture or harm the LIPO battery and it goes bad or explodes, for I've read that that can happen. Also, if I go with a LIPO battery, do I get a 2S or 3S battery? I've also read that the 3S can overheat and meltdown ESCs quickly, which I fear I may overuse the car and have it ruin all of the electronics from overheat. The ESC has a fan the size of the ESC itself that goes on top of it to cool it down and the motor has built in cooling ducts to keep the motor cool, but I'm still worried that the something will overheat and meltdown. Another one of my concerns is that I am going from a 540kv brushed motor that is over 25 turns that came with the car, to a 6800kv brushless 5.5T motor, which is a 12.5 increase in kv, so would this drastic change be harsh on the mechanics in the car and cause something to break or snap (Ex. a gear cracking and snapping into multiple pieces)? Any help or advice would be great! Thanks!

RustyUs

I would start with small steps when upgrading the Tamiya buggy. First off, check the dimensions of the battery tray. I don't think you will fit more than a 6 cell NiMh pack or 2S LiPo in there. You do know that most of the driveline is/has a lot of plastic to it. Right?

SyCo_VeNoM

wow they made it with a different chassis
The old Plasma Edge is probably my favorite RC

I know the older one could handle a cheap 35A 4000kv Brushless system easily as I've had my old DF-02 chassis plasma edge to where it was able to pull the front off the ground, and the same is with my on-road TT-01e... the TT-02b I dunno my guess is it should be able to handle the same. I left most my driveline stock plastic FWIW on those 2 RC's(I did get steel outputs though).
I would recommend changing all the plastic bushings to metal ball bearings 1st.

EngineerLife

I just did some measurements and a 3S LiPo battery will fit in the battery tray, and there are at least 8 cell NiMh batteries that fit in the battery tray. Also, I knew that most of the driveline has a lot of plastic to it, it's just that would that amount of plastic be enough to sustain a motor with the amount of kv this one has?

EngineerLife

Yup, they remade the Tamiya Plasma Edge. I personally like the body of the Tamiya Plasma Edge II better than the body on the Tamiya Plasma Edge, for the contrast of colors tends to stand out more (there is a lot of yellow in the Tamiya Plasma Edge II body). Anyway, what is the difference between having plastic bushings and metal ball bearings (besides the material being different)?

SyCo_VeNoM

well I didn't care about the paint job as I got the kit, and painted mine myself

But as for the difference less friction in the driveline so it runs smoother, and won't cause unnecessary strain on the motor.

EXT2Rob

My Feedback: (1)

OMG, yeah man, dump the bushings and get bearings. (What the hell is Tamiya thinking?? I think they're still back in the 80s)
Yet, they make semi-decent improvements to their old cars. I dunno, maybe they just have that Apple "think different" thing going on, but dang, guys, bushings? Really? In the 21st century? And don't get me started on the stupid Molex connector Tamiya still uses. Do yourself a favor, and cut that som***** off, right now, and replace it with a DECENT connector like a Traxxas or EC3. You use anything more than a 6-cell Nimh and the stock Mabuchi motor, and I guarantee that sucker will melt. They SUCK and should be BANNED from the hobby!!

Now, as for upgrading: Like Rusty said, measure stuff, like the battery tray, and compare to the dimensions of a 2S Lipo. Do NOT install a LIPO battery unless you've ditched that damn Molex connector!! And like Syco said, a mild 45A Hobbywing brushless system should be a good fit for that buggy and give you plenty of speed on the stock gearing. HobbyPartz.com usually has them, but they're outta stock right now. But google "Hobbywing 45A brushless combo" and see what ya come up with. I'd stick with a 4300kv motor, no higher. You can usually get the combo for $75. It's a screamin' little system, I've run them for years.

There is nothing to be worried about with Lipo packs, as long as you use a Lipo charger, and follow the general guidelines for their care: Make sure the LVC (Low-Voltage Cutoff) is enabled on the ESC to prevent the Lipo from being depleted below 3.0V/cell; never leave a pack fully charged for longer than necessary, and always Storage Charge your Lipos when you're done for the day. Storage charging is a function on the charger that automatically charges/dis-charges the pack to aprox. half charge, it's "resting voltage". This is important for the life of the pack. ALWAYS buy hard-case Lipo packs. NEVER use Tamiya plugs. The only way you can cause a fire with a Lipo is if you charge one using a Nimh charger, or a Nimh setting on a Lipo charger, or, if the pack gets physically damaged. (punctured)

All that said, if you want an off-roader RC that has better performance, buy something other than Tamiya. From what I've seen of Tamiya, they're more "moving models", with fine detail an all, but performance-wise, they're still stuck in the 80s.

EngineerLife

Is the Molex connector only the actual part that connects the wires, or does it also include the wires, because I've seen some ESCs where I would need to connect the wires straight into the ESC without a connector. Also, do HobbyPartz.com brushless motors and ESCs hold up? I've seen a few reviews in the past when looking at them that said that they don't hold up. Also, what has been your top speed while using these motors and on what kind of car/size? Finally, why don't you recommend anything over 4300kv? Sorry for all the questions, I'm new to this.

EngineerLife

When I bought the car, it came with the body and wing, but not painted, so I painted it anodized blue and put on the stickers that came with it. About the ball bearings, are there different sizes of ball bearings, and what changes when a bearing is sealed?

RustyUs

LMAO. Thanks once more for the laughs. You really dislike them Tamiya connectors, a lot! I remember when that style was pretty much it.

EXT2Rob

My Feedback: (1)

LOL, I know, it's a lot of info to take in. S'ok, mate. We've all been there! Yeah, the Molex connector is the white plastic bit on the wires from the ESC that mates to its counterpart on the battery wires. You can pretty much pick any way to connect your battery to your ESC, Some guys like the "direct" method, where you've got bullet connectors on the ends of theESC wires, and they plug into sockets in the Lipo pack. Technically, it does have the best physical and electrical connection you can get, but you have to be very careful with your charger, cuz you'd be dealing with bare connectors capable of touching each other. Me personally, I like the Traxxax connector.

HobbyWing motor systems are totally reliable. Even the $75 systems. It's amazing. I did have an issue once with one of the motor connectors, full disclosure. No big deal, I just soldered on a new one. Been perfect ever since. I suggest that motor system because a) I know it, I've run it on a couple different cars; and b) It's a small but speedy enough system for that Tamiya. And temperature should never be a problem.

You usually pick a motor system based on the weight of the vehicle. That HobbyWing EZrun system is a small-ish motor for your average 1/10 scale RC, But, size varies. Weight doesn't. That said, I've run that system in a 2wd 3.5lb stadium truck (perfect size and power) and in a 4wd 4.5lb truggy. (Ran fine with a motor fan) That motor has a great balance of torque and RPM for its size. I'm constantly amazed by it.

The average motor used is the 540 sized can, as it is known. The 4wd short course trucks will run a 550 size can for more torque. They're bigger and heavier. That EZrun motor is really a 380-size motor, "finned-out" to look like a 540. But it's a surprisingly potent little bugger. And since the Tamiya is a fairly small, light vehicle, be it 2wd or 4wd, that EZrun gets my vote for the best and least expensive brushless option.

Do you know how to solder? It's a useful skill in RC. If ya don't know, get someone to teach you properly. Look up on youtube even.

EXT2Rob

My Feedback: (1)

Oh, I didn't answer your KV question...

I suggested the 4300kv (or was it 4600kv?) cuz it has a nice balance of torque and RPM for its size. A number of things affect torque: Motor size (can diameter and length) and the motor's KV rating as well. A 540 can will have more torque than a 380 can, and a 550 can will have more toque than the 540 can. But two motors of the same dimensions, one with a 2800kv rating and the other with a 4600kv rating, the motor with the lower kv rating will have more torque, while the 4600kv will have higher RPM per volt = more speed. Does that light a bulb?

EngineerLife

Yes, now I understand, and no I do not know how to solder but I do own a soldering kit. I'll just look it up on youtube if I ever need to use it. Which ball bearings should I get? Are there different sizes in which I need to match up the size of the ball bearings?

EXT2Rob

My Feedback: (1)

Yes, you'll need to look at the kit's instructions, hopefully it will list the various sizes you'll need. There will probably be three to four different sizes. Do you have a nearby hobby store that may help you?

If not, and if the kit's instructions don't list the sizes, you'll probably have to Google "bearings for Tamiya plasma edge 2".

Bearing prices and quality vary. Boca and Acer bearings are the standard. I've tried cheaper bearings, but the balls are smaller and the races are flimsy. They don't last as long. Get the rubber sealed ones, they're easier to maintain. You can use the back side of a hobby knife to remove the seals and clean and re-lube the bearings, then pop the seals back in.

EXT2Rob

My Feedback: (1)

I just Googled bearings for Tamiya plasma edge 2 and got a bunch of hits. Fast Eddy is the one that came up most. Never tried Fast Eddy, but he's got full bearing kits for the car. According to the kit, you get twelve 5x11x4 and four 8x12x3.5. Huh, only two sizes. The kit's $16.

Mechanicaloverlord

Edit: IDK how or why but for some reason I didn't scroll down all the way and missed some replies made yesterday. Doh! So I apologize for anything that was already covered.

When we we refer to a connector it's the male and female parts on the esc and battery. In the case of the Molex connector that's the white parts on the esc and battery wires. Btw there's always a connector, some esc's don't include one though. Or it may be a Bullet style connector (google it) and will be hard to see.

All esc's have failures. Some are quality issues, then there's lots of user error resulting from crash damage, improper gearing and just abuse.

As for kv, you just don't anything higher for an off-road vehicle. The available gearing on the vehicle won't suit that high of a kv for one. Kv means the amount of rpm the motor will spin (with no load on it) per volt applied. So 4500kv on 2s (7.4v nominal) equals 33,300 rpm, in the vehicle the actual highest rpm will likely be more like 29-30,000 with optimal gearing. Anyway, gearing is used to tailor the load on the motor, too high of a load and the motor gets, same is true to an extent for not enough load. Load equals everything from vehicle weight, aerodynamics, the surface it being run on, etc. In fact you can have gearing that's with acceptable motor temps on pavement that overhearts the motor when you take it into the grass because grass places a higher load on the motor.

Now if we take your 6800kv on 2s that's 50,300rpm unloaded. For arguments sake let's say with the smallest pinion that'll fit the motor can only reach 40,000rpm. It can't go any higher because the load on the motor is too high causing it to overheat and you can't lower the load because you already have the smallest pinion on there. But with the 4500kv motor on 2s you'll be using a pinion that's more likely to be in the middle of the available gearing range. Voltage plays a role too, the 4500kv on 3s (11.1v nominal) is almost 50,000rpm. This puts it in the same boat as the 6800kv on 2s. In reality we don't know the actual rpm our motors achieve unless you have an esc with datalogging. I just throw the rpm numbers out there to illustrate the concept.

Btw, just from experience we can tell you that the lower kv motor on 2s will be enough. 3s will make the vehicle almost too powerful making control difficult and drivetrain parts a ticking bomb.

FlapJackFred

Tamiya's RC cars are great. They just need to step up and change a few things here and there. They need to have recommended motor and gearing charts. If only given a silver can Mabuchi motor in the kit; a list of parts needed to complete kit, and the manual only states a 6 cell NiMh battery pack...that tells me something right there. Now if the manual would suggest a 2S~3S LiPo pack...I could better assume the RC would handle more power.

Bottom line for me, If you want an off-road land rocket, Tamiya is probably not the best choice.

Sorry .

SyCo_VeNoM

I'd say they also need to lower their prices some as with a lot of their kits you are paying a pretty premium just for the Tamiya name, and some mediocre electronics you will chuck in the trash can(I got quite a few TEU104BK ESC's laying around...).