Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

For the last flying season, I switched to Bel-Ray MC-1 oil at 50:1 for all my engines. These include DA-50, Brisson 2.4, First Place 4.2, Zenoah GT-80, etc. Before this, I had been using various mineral based oils such as Lawn Boy at 32:1. Examining each engine this fall, I see less carbon on the pistons .... some are even shiney aluminum now where they showed hard carbon before. Plugs look pefect ... light brown color with no wet oil deposits. Overall, I can't complain at all about the performance of this oil. But to be frank, I really couldn't complain before the switch other than more plug and piston deposits ... and more oil residue on the airframe.

My question is this .... what is the difference between Bel-Ray HR1 vs MC-1. I believe one of these is combustible where the other one is not. Bel-Ray's literature and web site are unclear on the differences. Searches here on RCU shows references to both oils and little negative info. I'm interested to hear other users experiences with these oils.

If I had to choose again, I believe I could be equaly satisfied with PennZoil or Stihl oil... or perhaps any one of several other oils out there. But for now, Bel-Ray is working extremely well for me.

Roger S

mrbigg

My Feedback: (21)

MC1 is geared for liquid or aircooled engines. HR1 is more for liquid cooled engines being as they claim it's for powervalve equipped engines. Here's a link. [link]http://www.motorcycleproshop.com/acc/belray/belray.asp[/link]

Richard L.

My Feedback: (24)

HR1 can only be mixed to 50:1 whereas MC1 can be mixed up to 80:1.

blkbird68

My Feedback: (19)

I have contacted BelRay before about proper use of their oils and which one would be the correct oil to use in our applications.

The simple answer as mrbigg stated, H1R is for water-cooled applications, MC-1 is for air-cooled high stress applications. They recommended using MC-1 and suggested that if I wanted to use H1R for R/C applications that I not mix it any leaner than 32:1.

Scoubidou

My Feedback: (17)

I have not seen that H1-R is for liquid cooled engines?

I used Belray H1R at 32:1 for my DA-50 and ZDZ80 mixed at 32:1 for at least 20 gallons of gas last summer. My pistons and ring are like new.

DA recommend H1R.
http://www.troybuiltmodels.com/50Manual.pdf

blkbird68

My Feedback: (19)

The first time that I heard that it was mainly for water-cooled engines was when Belray tech support answered my email. I don't recall it saying anything about that on the bottle. Regardless, Belray says MC-1 is what should be used in this type of engine so that's what I use and it works great. I have used MC-1 for many years and have never had an issue, although I am currently testing some redline 2 stroke oil out of curiosity.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

I talked to MRBIG about our application and he said that since we ran such a light load on our engines that MC-1 at 80:1 was OK. Our usage is not considered a harsh or heavy load environment.

BAS

My Feedback: (28)

I was wondering what the difference was also like Roger stated we both switched this past season and i am extremely happy also with the results. Thanks for the reply .

Sturtz

My Feedback: (20)

Belray H1R at 40:1 in everything. Runs strong, clean and never fouled a plug yet. Zero carbon buildup too.

Scoubidou

My Feedback: (17)

Just some clarifications. I used 32:1 H1R for breakin only and i switched to 40:1 as per ZDZ recommendations.

I found another site explaining the difference between H1R and MCI:
Both oil can be used for liquid cooled or air cooled engine.

MC1 is for 50:1 to 80:1 oil mix
H1R is for 30:1 to 50:1 mix

http://www.motoxoutlet.com/browsepro...troke-oil.HTML

http://www.motoxoutlet.com/browsepro...troke-oil.html

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

From what I understand when I was researching it, one is recommended for power valves or Rotex engines. The other one is not. Not really sure what I power valve is but the H1R is good for them.

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

Thanks everybody for the information and the links. And .... I can't believe not one negative comment so far. That is rare for any kind of oil thread!

I had used MC-1 several years ago and decided to give it a try again this year. I stayed with it because it seemed to work very well and it was available at a local motorcycle shop that I drive by regularly. They do not carry H1R. I'll probably switch to 60:1 or so next season just to reduce the oil bill a bit.

Roger S.

Don M.

My Feedback: (5)

Here's an answer I just received from Bel Ray when I quizzed them about the best oil for my gassers.



Bel-Ray MC-1 is the best choice and you can use it up to 70:1 in the aircraft engine. Please contact your local motorcycle dealerships to buy Bel-Ray products.

Thanks,

Sir Tech

mrbigg

My Feedback: (21)

Powervalves are a rotating drum in the cylinder of a liquid-cooled 2 stroke engines. Every manufacture's setup works differently but the effects are pretty much the same. What they do is partially close off the exhaust port at low RPM and progressively open with RPM increase until the port is entirely open. This helps with bottom end torque.
These have a tendency to "stick" once in a while because of the black goo in the exhaust. It's a no-brainer when it comes to the HR1. It's recommended for powervalve equipped engines. There are no air-cooled dirtbikes that I recall ever being built with a powervalve. The only ones I've seen or read about were all liquid cooled.

mrbigg

My Feedback: (21)

I don't think you talked to me. I don't remember anyway! I would run it no leaner than 50:1 myself. I used to run it at 40:1 in my 500cc bike.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

You are right. I didn't unless you work for Belray in New Jersey.

GoeKeli

My Feedback: (18)

Mr.B, perhaps a safe number for our ran working 2 stoke air cooled might be 32-1? Should not see build up at that ratio? Does it the MC-1 come in gallon containers?

Joe Kelley

mrbigg

My Feedback: (21)

I would not run any richer than 40 to 1 with MC1. I've read at the dirt bike forums that people were fouling plugs that rich. They leaned it out and had no problems. Everyone was also saying how clean their engines were after switching over to MC1. I've personally seen this myself with my 500. The piston was really clean after may gallons of fuel.

Josey Wales

My Feedback: (61)

Do you mean switching from H1R over to MC1 ?

Sturtz

My Feedback: (20)

Same question here Josey. Been using HR1 with zero problems . I ran MC1 at 32:1 in my Kawasaki KX250s during my racing days.
If someone with proof can show me why I need to switch to MC1 I have no problem doing so. Local cycle shop sells both.
I didn't even see the MC1 listed in the product area at [link=http://www.Belray.com]BelRay[/link]

H1R WITH POWER VALVE FORMULA IS A FULLY SYNTHETIC OIL. DESIGNED TO GIVE MAX HORSEPOWER WITH THE MINIMUM OF FRICTION, AT THE SAME TIME GIVING ADDED ANTI WEAR QUALITIES. LEAVES VIRTUALLY NO CARBON DEPOSITS ON POWER VALVES, MEANING LESS MAINTENANCE IS REQUIRED WHILE GIVING BETTER PERFORMANCE. PRE-MIX ONLY CAN BE MIXED @ RATIO'S FROM 30:1 TO 50:1. RECOMENDED MIX IS 40:1
AVAILABLE IN 1 LITRE BOTTLE.

blkbird68

My Feedback: (19)

[link=http://www.belray.com/consumer/product_results.fsp?category=2-Stroke&q=mc-1]MC-1[/link]

Pretty easy to find....

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

With first hand tear down experience, I can see no reason to switch to the MC-! at ratios as lean as 60-1. After performing tear downs of what many would consider to be high time engines, I know that there is little to no visible wear on the piston and cylinder. There is residual carbon on the dome and the top of the piston but the vast majority of that wipes off with a dry paper towel. Ring lands remained essentially clean, and at 50-1 there is a lot of residual oil on all the parts after shut down. Bearings appear to be in extremely good condition, and this oil cleans very well at reasonable ratios as well. If the plug is becoming fouled the mixture settings still need a little adjustment. All the plugs that I've examined show extremely clean burning with proper needle settings. Running engine temps have been excellent.

Josey Wales

My Feedback: (61)

Sounds good SS..I can get either one local so its not a big deal..anyone tried H1R leaner than 50:1 ?

Scoubidou

My Feedback: (17)

I run H1R 40:1 as per ZDZ, MVVS and Belray recommendations for 1 year and on 3 gassers :
H1R is for 30:1 to 50:1 mix
MC1 is for 50:1 to 80:1 oil mix


I do not understand why people always want to do something else than what manufacturer suggest for their own products?
Daniel

Josey Wales

My Feedback: (61)

I really doubt that the difference between running 50:1 or 60:1 will harm any engine..your talking 2.5oz vs 2.1oz per gallon..now 50:1 and 80:1 is a big jump. Besides thats what its all about..experimenting within reason.