AMA forum censorship
08-02-2010, 03:39 PM
#51
RE: AMA forum censorship
I have often disagreed with Mr. Cain on some points however as a whole I beleve he is what was needed in his two more recent bids for a national AMA office and I did vote for him, possibly even agine.
You know over the years even when I read his DVP columns years ago I have never ever had to listen to him whine about not being able to pay back his 200K education loan and he can.t make as much as a doctor, such as his personal attacker and thread starter Mr dbcisco.
John
edited to correct my poor spelling
You know over the years even when I read his DVP columns years ago I have never ever had to listen to him whine about not being able to pay back his 200K education loan and he can.t make as much as a doctor, such as his personal attacker and thread starter Mr dbcisco.
John
edited to correct my poor spelling
08-02-2010, 04:02 PM
#52
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: combatpigg
If only you could hear how unAmerican that sounds. Banning someone from the AMA for expressing his view point that is a threat to no one. I don't know what country you're from, but that isn't the way we do things here.
We won't go into the hard work and good that this guy has given in his lifetime to the AMA and the hobby.
If only you could hear how unAmerican that sounds. Banning someone from the AMA for expressing his view point that is a threat to no one. I don't know what country you're from, but that isn't the way we do things here.
We won't go into the hard work and good that this guy has given in his lifetime to the AMA and the hobby.
08-02-2010, 04:10 PM
#53
Banned
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lansdale,
PA
Posts: 2,045
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: JohnBuckner
You know over the years even when I read his DVP columns years ago I have never ever had to listen to him whine about not being able to pay back his 200K education loan and he can.t make as much as a doctor, such as his personal attacker and thread starter Mr dbcisco.
You know over the years even when I read his DVP columns years ago I have never ever had to listen to him whine about not being able to pay back his 200K education loan and he can.t make as much as a doctor, such as his personal attacker and thread starter Mr dbcisco.
I never whined about my student loans, I simply countered the arguement that M.D.s are the only ones who are paying off their educational costs.
What personal attack?
I made an error in Mr. Cains role in the AMA which, after confirmation by the AMA I promply admitted my mistake.
I have no clue as to why you whine about thngs that never occured.
Quit insulting and fabricating things to drag me back into this thread to defend myself.
08-02-2010, 04:10 PM
#54
My Feedback: (58)
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: here
Posts: 5,413
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: JohnBuckner
You know over the years even when I read his DVP columns years ago I have never ever had to listen to him whine about not being able to pay back his 200K education loan and he can.t make as much as a doctor,
John
You know over the years even when I read his DVP columns years ago I have never ever had to listen to him whine about not being able to pay back his 200K education loan and he can.t make as much as a doctor,
John
08-02-2010, 04:22 PM
#55
My Feedback: (58)
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: here
Posts: 5,413
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: dbcisco
Quit insulting and fabricating things to drag me back into this thread to defend myself.
Quit insulting and fabricating things to drag me back into this thread to defend myself.
That is one of the oldest trick in the book. Instead of an on topic or relevant post...just attack the messenger instead. Yep, instead of pointing out things you may have gotten wrong...many will just deflect your points by some other inappropriate diversion... works quite well usually...
08-02-2010, 04:31 PM
#56
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: Tarasdad
I, sir, am an American. A Native Texan, as a matter of fact.
My view differs from yours in that I see Mr. Cain's viewpoint as destructive to the AMA. As someone who has been an elected official in the past and one who continues to run ''on occasion'' his attitude has a very real possibilty of being presented IN AN OFFICIAL MANNER as that of the AMA when nothing could be (or SHOULD be) further from the truth. The AMA supports ALL aspects of model aviation, not just those approved of by Mr. Cain.
As for the good he's done, well I'm sorry but all that counts for naught when you start denegrating part of the hobby. Whatever he may have done in the past his apparent attitude now runs counter to everything the AMA stands for.
I stand by everything I said.
I, sir, am an American. A Native Texan, as a matter of fact.
My view differs from yours in that I see Mr. Cain's viewpoint as destructive to the AMA. As someone who has been an elected official in the past and one who continues to run ''on occasion'' his attitude has a very real possibilty of being presented IN AN OFFICIAL MANNER as that of the AMA when nothing could be (or SHOULD be) further from the truth. The AMA supports ALL aspects of model aviation, not just those approved of by Mr. Cain.
As for the good he's done, well I'm sorry but all that counts for naught when you start denegrating part of the hobby. Whatever he may have done in the past his apparent attitude now runs counter to everything the AMA stands for.
I stand by everything I said.
If you really think there is a possibility of Hoss's thoughts on that matter being presented in an official manner by the AMA......well, there's no use ....
08-02-2010, 05:07 PM
#57
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: warbird_1
spoken like a true liberal lol
ORIGINAL: combatpigg
If only you could hear how unAmerican that sounds. Banning someone from the AMA for expressing his view point that is a threat to no one. I don't know what country you're from, but that isn't the way we do things here.
We won't go into the hard work and good that this guy has given in his lifetime to the AMA and the hobby.
If only you could hear how unAmerican that sounds. Banning someone from the AMA for expressing his view point that is a threat to no one. I don't know what country you're from, but that isn't the way we do things here.
We won't go into the hard work and good that this guy has given in his lifetime to the AMA and the hobby.
spoken like a true moron lol
08-02-2010, 05:18 PM
#58
Banned
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lansdale,
PA
Posts: 2,045
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
I actually admire Cain for being honest. I also have no problem with him stating his opinion. I do not want him out of the AMA.
I simply want the AMA to say what they are really about instead of giving lip service to their stated purpose . If they want it to be just about flying competitions and expensive planes, then say so. I can handle that. Half hearted bait and switch tactics (IMHO PPP is that), autonomous clubs doing and supporting whatever they want, etc. is not doing anything to "promote development of model aviation as a recognized sport and worthwhile recreation activity". Note it does not say "to provided insurance for private clubs, run competitions, protect RCers from the FAA and FCC" I will grant that the Museum is a very wondeful way of promoting the hobby, much of the rest of the "promotional" activities are more like a membership drive than promoting the hobby and pale in comparison to the competitions which seem to get the lion's share of attention.
I simply want the AMA to say what they are really about instead of giving lip service to their stated purpose . If they want it to be just about flying competitions and expensive planes, then say so. I can handle that. Half hearted bait and switch tactics (IMHO PPP is that), autonomous clubs doing and supporting whatever they want, etc. is not doing anything to "promote development of model aviation as a recognized sport and worthwhile recreation activity". Note it does not say "to provided insurance for private clubs, run competitions, protect RCers from the FAA and FCC" I will grant that the Museum is a very wondeful way of promoting the hobby, much of the rest of the "promotional" activities are more like a membership drive than promoting the hobby and pale in comparison to the competitions which seem to get the lion's share of attention.
08-02-2010, 05:32 PM
#59
RE: AMA forum censorship
PPP was a classic example of trying to sell ice to a Eskimo.
I'm not above smuggly proclaiming to all the ill fated PPP supporters, "I told you so".
Y'all can go find some rocks to crawl under in shame, none of you slack jawed yokels could lead soda through a straw.
I'm not above smuggly proclaiming to all the ill fated PPP supporters, "I told you so".
Y'all can go find some rocks to crawl under in shame, none of you slack jawed yokels could lead soda through a straw.
08-02-2010, 05:35 PM
#60
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: California City,
CA
Posts: 545
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
I just have a low tolerance level for elitism. At least that's what I interpret Mr. Cain's statement to be. That said I'll withdraw my comments about booting him from AMA. I admit that was wrong, and Mr. Cain you have my humblest apologies. Doesn't mean I agree with what you said, but that's not a reason for me to say what I did. Differences of opinion happen and are grounds for reasonable discussion, not trying to silence those opinions.
Going to do my best to think first, post second from now on, especially when under the weather (diverticulitis flare up).
Going to do my best to think first, post second from now on, especially when under the weather (diverticulitis flare up).
08-02-2010, 05:55 PM
#61
RE: AMA forum censorship
You've got my respect. I also comiserate with your lower GI flare up, no fun.
There's no argument that his statement is controversial and not surprising it's enough to make some very angry.
I understand some elitist attitudes, though. People put alot of their own time and resources into establishing a nice club, a nice facility and reserve the right to be able to accept or reject those who apply for membership. No one has an inalienable right to join the club that I fly at. It's not part of any public domain. It's a private endevour.
There's no argument that his statement is controversial and not surprising it's enough to make some very angry.
I understand some elitist attitudes, though. People put alot of their own time and resources into establishing a nice club, a nice facility and reserve the right to be able to accept or reject those who apply for membership. No one has an inalienable right to join the club that I fly at. It's not part of any public domain. It's a private endevour.
08-02-2010, 06:06 PM
#62
Banned
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lansdale,
PA
Posts: 2,045
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
I respect the right of a private club to do whatever they want within the confines of the law. What I do not like is the way the AMA makes it sound like any AMA member will be "accepted" at any club. If the AMA has no say in what clubs do, then the AMA is doing very little to unify and promote the hobby. I don't see VFW clubs chase away a member from another club because,"We only allow WWII vets here, no Korean War vets allowed." On the other hand, I did know that the VFW was reluctant to embrace Nam vets. However, that did change.
The clubs seem to be private enterprises with AMA insurance. If that be the case then the AMA is little more than an insurance salesman as far as clubs go.
The clubs seem to be private enterprises with AMA insurance. If that be the case then the AMA is little more than an insurance salesman as far as clubs go.
08-02-2010, 06:13 PM
#63
Banned
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lansdale,
PA
Posts: 2,045
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
One last thing. RCU has the right to censor or delete anything they want, it is a private industry. Even if I don;t agree with it.
The AMA is a public entity and does not have the right to destroy a public record. No, I am not going further with it. It doesn;t excuse them though.
So mods, you have free reign to cut my posts to ribbons.
I will cry but that is your right as long as it isn't done in a biased manner or single out individuals.
The AMA is a public entity and does not have the right to destroy a public record. No, I am not going further with it. It doesn;t excuse them though.
So mods, you have free reign to cut my posts to ribbons.
I will cry but that is your right as long as it isn't done in a biased manner or single out individuals.
08-02-2010, 06:30 PM
#64
RE: AMA forum censorship
If I was in charge of the AMA's forum, I would make it for the purpose of answering AMA related questions from the membership and would not allow any discourse between members or any public "tattle-tale" sessions about one member or another. Those threads would immediately disappear.
That forum would not be a "hang out" or source of bickering between or about members, it would be strictly AMA business and most likely quite boring.
That forum would not be a "hang out" or source of bickering between or about members, it would be strictly AMA business and most likely quite boring.
08-02-2010, 06:49 PM
#65
Banned
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lansdale,
PA
Posts: 2,045
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
CP, they have that and I've used it. There's an "ask AMA" link on the AMA website. It took a few repeated requests to get someone to actually answer my questions, but persistence paid off. Actually got some good, helpful and personable answers and information.
08-02-2010, 07:50 PM
#67
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: sheridan,
IN
Posts: 1,167
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
I had high hopes for that forum, and the Q&A thing works reasonably well, but it has turned into a little club itself.
It seems like 2 guys there hover over their keyboards 24-7. You can hardly get a word in edge-wise.[:@]
It seems like 2 guys there hover over their keyboards 24-7. You can hardly get a word in edge-wise.[:@]
08-02-2010, 09:25 PM
#70
My Feedback: (58)
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: here
Posts: 5,413
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: dbcisco
I didn't get far on the AMA foum, more annoying than here
It was the Ask AMA link that finally got me valid info.
I didn't get far on the AMA foum, more annoying than here
It was the Ask AMA link that finally got me valid info.
08-02-2010, 10:40 PM
#71
My Feedback: (109)
RE: AMA forum censorship
The AMA forum is a joke-censorship at its best-if your post does not fit the moderators idea it will be deleted or lockdown, I have it seen several times on my own posts in that forum as well as a moderator changing and editing his own post days after it was posted in the middle of discussions to try to reshape the discussions as they evolved-If you would like details please PM me and I will provide you with names, dates and individual posts-and if you bit*h too loud you can be suspended!
One other thing will I am posting which will certainly add more to this discussion, Horrace Cain has been around for a while and contributed alot to the Academy and he puts his pants on just like we all do but he is heard "LOUD AND CLEAR" at Muncie while others are not. I hope more people would get involved like Horrace and have a firm opinion whatever it may be at the national level as well as at the local club level and do the work to accomplish the goal. Happy flying
One other thing will I am posting which will certainly add more to this discussion, Horrace Cain has been around for a while and contributed alot to the Academy and he puts his pants on just like we all do but he is heard "LOUD AND CLEAR" at Muncie while others are not. I hope more people would get involved like Horrace and have a firm opinion whatever it may be at the national level as well as at the local club level and do the work to accomplish the goal. Happy flying
08-02-2010, 11:06 PM
#72
Banned
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lansdale,
PA
Posts: 2,045
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
Like I said, I don't like what he said but I admire him for being honest.
As for the AMA censoring, as a public entity I would say they are on dangerous ground. It is kind of of like falsifying a public record.
Can you imagine your school board deleting comments from a meeting that they didn't agree with? Imagine those places that video tape or record meetings, what if they edited the recordings or turned off the recorder when a citizen makes a comment. I think in the case of the school board the perpetrators would be ruined financially if not imprisoned. However, since less than 1% ever vote in AMA adminstrative elections, I am pretty sure nobody cares what the AMA does.
As for the AMA censoring, as a public entity I would say they are on dangerous ground. It is kind of of like falsifying a public record.
Can you imagine your school board deleting comments from a meeting that they didn't agree with? Imagine those places that video tape or record meetings, what if they edited the recordings or turned off the recorder when a citizen makes a comment. I think in the case of the school board the perpetrators would be ruined financially if not imprisoned. However, since less than 1% ever vote in AMA adminstrative elections, I am pretty sure nobody cares what the AMA does.
08-03-2010, 05:37 AM
#73
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: FrederickMD
Posts: 2,114
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
AMA is not a "public entity". It is a Non-Profit organization representing the interests of the membership in accordance with established by-laws. They removed factually inaccurate information from a forum. Under the terms of service agreement, which you had to electronically accept, " The AMA reserves the right to reject, remove or modify any content, materials and information, in whole or in part at any time for any reason." It is nothing like "falsifying a public record".
They removed your post because it was completely misrepresenting the facts. Get over it, and move on with your life. Quit AMA. Don't quit AMA. Join a club. Don't join a club. Make your own choices.
Brad
They removed your post because it was completely misrepresenting the facts. Get over it, and move on with your life. Quit AMA. Don't quit AMA. Join a club. Don't join a club. Make your own choices.
Brad
08-03-2010, 09:18 AM
#74
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Anytown
Posts: 1,287
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: bkdavy
AMA is not a "public entity". It is a Non-Profit organization representing the interests of the membership in accordance with established by-laws. They removed factually inaccurate information from a forum. Under the terms of service agreement, which you had to electronically accept, " The AMA reserves the right to reject, remove or modify any content, materials and information, in whole or in part at any time for any reason." It is nothing like "falsifying a public record".
They removed your post because it was completely misrepresenting the facts. Get over it, and move on with your life. Quit AMA. Don't quit AMA. Join a club. Don't join a club. Make your own choices.
Brad
AMA is not a "public entity". It is a Non-Profit organization representing the interests of the membership in accordance with established by-laws. They removed factually inaccurate information from a forum. Under the terms of service agreement, which you had to electronically accept, " The AMA reserves the right to reject, remove or modify any content, materials and information, in whole or in part at any time for any reason." It is nothing like "falsifying a public record".
They removed your post because it was completely misrepresenting the facts. Get over it, and move on with your life. Quit AMA. Don't quit AMA. Join a club. Don't join a club. Make your own choices.
Brad
08-03-2010, 10:06 AM
#75
My Feedback: (58)
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: here
Posts: 5,413
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: AMA forum censorship
ORIGINAL: K-Bob
A-freakin-men!
A-freakin-men!
why is it when RCU exercises rights that "you had to electronically accept" to be a member here it is OK to go over there and cry to mommy about it?
