rudder/alieron mixing
01-30-2003, 06:42 AM
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rudder/alieron mixing
I have an avistar with a 6 channel futaba computer radio. I was flying in the wind today and it got me thinking about mixing the rudder and alierons. Is this a good idea? I've been flying alone most of the time and haven't crashed in many landings. But landing today in the crosswind was very difficult. Will this straighten out my plane? Will it be a lot more difficult to fly? If not, should I keep the mixing at 50%, or lower? Thanks for the help.
01-30-2003, 09:11 AM
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rudder/alieron mixing
I know that mixing has become very fashionable over the last few years, I suspect that this has more to do with the fact that people can (because computer radios make it simple to do) rather than because people need to.
I so far have used mixing for only two reasons.
One model I have is a delta and needs elevon control.
The other reason I have used computer mixes is to transfer the gear and flap functions from their default switches/knobs on my Futaba FF8, to the two toggle switches above the throttle stick so that there is less fumbling around to find these controls when I need them.
I avoid all other mixes, my own personal view is that it is better to fly the plane 'manually' as it improves my skill level rather relying on any automation, my advice would therefore be to keep the main controls unmixed and learn and practice how to do it the hard way.
I accept that 3D flying may be much easier with some mixing, not my area of interest so I can't help with the pro's and con's on this one.
If you were to mix aileron/rudder to deal with a cross wind, what would you do on those days when you had a cross wind from the opposite direction?
I am sure that there are many who would argue for mixing and that the case for this may be strong, but ask yourself what you would have done 20 years ago before computer radios came out, we all managed then.
Simon.
I so far have used mixing for only two reasons.
One model I have is a delta and needs elevon control.
The other reason I have used computer mixes is to transfer the gear and flap functions from their default switches/knobs on my Futaba FF8, to the two toggle switches above the throttle stick so that there is less fumbling around to find these controls when I need them.
I avoid all other mixes, my own personal view is that it is better to fly the plane 'manually' as it improves my skill level rather relying on any automation, my advice would therefore be to keep the main controls unmixed and learn and practice how to do it the hard way.
I accept that 3D flying may be much easier with some mixing, not my area of interest so I can't help with the pro's and con's on this one.
If you were to mix aileron/rudder to deal with a cross wind, what would you do on those days when you had a cross wind from the opposite direction?
I am sure that there are many who would argue for mixing and that the case for this may be strong, but ask yourself what you would have done 20 years ago before computer radios came out, we all managed then.
Simon.
01-30-2003, 10:22 AM
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rudder/alieron mixing
Using rudder with aileron in a turn is what allows an aircraft to turn most efficiently. It straightens out the fuselage in relation to the wind and gives you a nice smooth turn. This is something that's drilled into your head big time with full scale flying.
The problem with using the mixer to couple rudder with aileron is that you don't always need the exact same amount. For example, say you're making a right hand turn. You use the ailerons to roll the aircraft right and feed in a bit of right rudder to coordinate the turn. While you're in the turn, you no longer need the aileron to keep the plane turning, but the rudder still needs to be in to keep it coordinated. If it's mixed, as soon as you relax the ailerons, you lose your rudder. My advice, practice coordinating your rudder/aileron movements w/out the mixing and have an instructor give you some tips on crosswind landings.
I know several pilots that bore holes in the sky all day without coordinating their turns with rudder, but not learning it can get you in real trouble as you get low and slow on your landing approaches. FYI, the amount of rudder needed to coordinate a turn is very very small. Play around with different amounts and you'll be able to see how the aircraft responds.
Cougar
The problem with using the mixer to couple rudder with aileron is that you don't always need the exact same amount. For example, say you're making a right hand turn. You use the ailerons to roll the aircraft right and feed in a bit of right rudder to coordinate the turn. While you're in the turn, you no longer need the aileron to keep the plane turning, but the rudder still needs to be in to keep it coordinated. If it's mixed, as soon as you relax the ailerons, you lose your rudder. My advice, practice coordinating your rudder/aileron movements w/out the mixing and have an instructor give you some tips on crosswind landings.
I know several pilots that bore holes in the sky all day without coordinating their turns with rudder, but not learning it can get you in real trouble as you get low and slow on your landing approaches. FYI, the amount of rudder needed to coordinate a turn is very very small. Play around with different amounts and you'll be able to see how the aircraft responds.
Cougar
01-30-2003, 03:10 PM
#4
rudder/alieron mixing
I agree with the previous post about mixing, and will add something else...
When landing in a crosswind, mixing will not only NOT help, but it will hurt. This is because when landing in a crosswind, you want to do the opposite of coordinating your turns. That is, Right Aileron with Left Rudder (or vice versa) to create a side slip in the wind which guides you straight down the runway.
When landing in a crosswind, mixing will not only NOT help, but it will hurt. This is because when landing in a crosswind, you want to do the opposite of coordinating your turns. That is, Right Aileron with Left Rudder (or vice versa) to create a side slip in the wind which guides you straight down the runway.
01-30-2003, 03:34 PM
#5
rudder/alieron mixing
Originally posted by MinnFlyer
I agree with the previous post about mixing, and will add something else...
When landing in a crosswind, mixing will not only NOT help, but it will hurt. This is because when landing in a crosswind, you want to do the opposite of coordinating your turns. That is, Right Aileron with Left Rudder (or vice versa) to create a side slip in the wind which guides you straight down the runway.
I agree with the previous post about mixing, and will add something else...
When landing in a crosswind, mixing will not only NOT help, but it will hurt. This is because when landing in a crosswind, you want to do the opposite of coordinating your turns. That is, Right Aileron with Left Rudder (or vice versa) to create a side slip in the wind which guides you straight down the runway.
I was afraid no one else was going to say that.
01-31-2003, 01:55 AM
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rudder/alieron mixing
Minn Flyer and Chassan are exactly right. Mixing will not help you in a cross wind, frequently you will need to cross control in a heavy cross wind.
For example, if the wind is at your back and you are landing from left to right, you will frequently need to "spread" the sticks to land on the stripe. I.E. you will use a bit of right aileron to hold the upwind wing down, and a bit of left rudder just as you touch down to pull the plane out of a crab and align the landing gear with the direction the plane is travelling.
In the same situation, landing right to left, you would need to "pinch" the sticks to achieve the same thing.
For example, if the wind is at your back and you are landing from left to right, you will frequently need to "spread" the sticks to land on the stripe. I.E. you will use a bit of right aileron to hold the upwind wing down, and a bit of left rudder just as you touch down to pull the plane out of a crab and align the landing gear with the direction the plane is travelling.
In the same situation, landing right to left, you would need to "pinch" the sticks to achieve the same thing.
