fiery

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A video showing the flammability of various fuel oil products.

All except Avgas 100 LL / Gasoline could be used as the paraffinic component of model diesel fuel.

Disclaimer: I don't recommend what the presenter does. Don't try any of what you see for yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nL10C7FSbE

qazimoto

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What the presenter is really doing here is demonstrating Darwinian Natural Selection at work.

:-)

Mr Cox

It is only the petrol that gets a bit dangerous, you can see how the vapours reach well outside of the can while he fiddles with the match, quite instructional I think. But yes, don't try this at home...

scottyo

So if you used diesel fuel or heating oil as the paraffin component, how would that change the other components? Less oil? More ether? Has anyone used one of these in model diesel fuel?

qazimoto

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While a few other common Hydro-Carbons can replace Kerosene in model Diesel fuel, Engine performance is usually effected. They can also fill your engine with soot or other black gunk.

Kerosene is still best, .and it behaves predictably with the other fuel components using the standard fuel recopies.

As for dropping lighted matches onto jars full of volatile liquids, check out this link.

http://www.theherald.com.au/story/29...tro-explosion/

fiery

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I have used jet A-1, white spirit, and household kerosene as the fuel base. Household kerosene has given the most issues. A flying friend has used mil. spec. AVTUR (the slops from water testing) without problem. I suspect (but cannot say) it is the same as Jet A-1. Not my field of expertise. My father was knowledgeable about all this, being familiar with refinery operation. I have forgotten most of what he used to say. He used phrases like "wide cut", "cracked", "long-chain" and the like.

From Wiki (for what it is worth)

"Although not normally marketed as a fuel, white spirit can be used as an alternative to kerosene in portable stoves, since it is merely a light grade of kerosene.[SUP][citation needed][/SUP] It cannot be used as an alternative to white gas, which is a much more volatile gasoline-like fuel".

qazimoto

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A local Chemical Engineer reckons that all Australian Kerosene is Jet-A1

It might be worthwhile re-introducing this link to a rather long and meaty thread on the UK based Barton Control Line site. It;s a discussion about Kero.and possible replacements, although it rambles a bit.

http://controlline.org.uk/phpBB2/vie...+kero&&start=0

fiery

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"A local Chemical Engineer reckons that all Australian Kerosene is Jet-A1"

That appears to make economic sense, though it has blue dye and butyl alcohol added?

qazimoto

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Certainly blue dye, who knows if it has Butyl Alcohol or not. Jet-A1 seems to have various additives as well. I think the message from the long thread cited above is to find some Kero that works, buy a stash and stick to it.

fiery

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Hi Ray

From a post you made in 2007 on the Barton thread linked above.

"# Perhaps most interesting was the revelation that they (Recochem) add one half percent of Butyl Alcohol to the kero that goes into their one and four litre packages and have done so for the past ten months. This is a requirement by the Australian Taxation Office (ATO) so they don't have to pay excise on the kero. It is meant to make it difficult to run in an internal combustion engine according to page two of the following ATO document:

http://www.ato.gov.au/content/downlo...2006_76553.pdf

Sounds like the culprit! "



Adulterated kero may or may not run just fine in our little compression iginition engines. However last week-end I used the last of my 'white spirit' and IPN brew in my lovely GB 5. Ran smooth and steady.

The ATO link copied above is no longer operative.

Changed to my new batch of KCB kero and 2-EHN (Amsoil) fuel and it was unhappy, with a persistent misfire no mater what needle/comp setting I tried. Of course the DII component could need adjusting. Makes me want to go back to the white spirit brew but I have 7 litres of KCB kero on hand and a near full quart bottle of Amsoil cetane boost!

My friend has promised to let me have some AVTUR (JP-8?) so we'll try that. Price is right

A further thought. Off topic I know, and not really my thing at all, but this is close to 'state of the art' for turbine powered R/C aircraft and flown at a local club. It features a very expensive "top drawer" German made power plant.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qp0sCX_iFM

The owner advised he does not use kerosene or Jet A-1 for the fuel base. What does he use? Automotive distillate (diesel fuel oil) straight out the bowser!

earlwb

You sort of have me wondering if the "white spirit" stuff you talk about may be the same stuff that we call Coleman Lantern Fuel (camp fuel) here in the USA, which is a naptha based fuel. They sell the Coleman fuel most everywhere around here as well. The Coleman fuel is used in the camping stoves, lanterns, heaters, etc.

fiery

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Hi Earl

My understanding is White Spirit is the UK and Commonwealth equivalent to what is known in the US as Mineral Spirits.

Coleman fuel is a proprietary stove naptha. Our equivalent in Australia to Coleman Fuel is "Shellite".

steve111

Jet A1 has various additives like antifungals and FSII (Fuel System Icing Inhibitor), so I'd be a bit surprised if all kero sold here was Jet A1. But then I'm often surprised.

I've used Jet A1 (near enough to the same as JP8/F34) quite a lot in model diesels, with good results. We also recently got hold of some F44 (JP5/AVCAT), which is what the Navy uses. The flashpoint is higher, at 60C vs 38C. I found starting much harder (unsurprisingly) but once running, it seemed no different to AVTUR.

qazimoto

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I think that the suggestion is that straight out of the refining process all "Kerosene" is to Jet-A1 specs which are pretty wide.. Additives are put in later for both Jet fuel and househild kero.


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