can773

My Feedback: (1)

We already have the office staff...why can they not look after organizing the non-event part of a Nats.....committee chairs generally look after SIG events anyways...

The office could look after things like porta potties...food...awards....whatever else is required. Its not rocket science, and since we are already paying them its nothing more out of MAAC's pocket.

Please dont tell me that they are so overworked that it could not happen.

This is basically the way the AMA runs their Nats...which is the biggest single RC event worldwide. The NSRCA (the SIG for pattern in the US) runs the entire show from scorekeeping, to flightline setup, judging, runners etc etc etc....AMA provides registration and facilities but otherwise thats it. All volunteers....

Our nats would be much smaller so I dont see how our office staff could not take it upon themselves to sort it out......

Anyways, it is of little concern to me as I have little to no interest in attending a Nats in this country after all the BS that is surrounding them....unless they are SIG only events ran by the SIG in question.

reo

My Feedback: (130)

Chad, what would the 'non-event' part of the Nats entail?....Ron

can773

My Feedback: (1)

Read the next paragraph for a start.

Ed Smith

There is no comparison between the AMA Nats/AMA staff and MAAC Nats/MAAC staff.

It is much easier for the AMA staff to to do as Chad says than it is for MAAC staff. The AMA Nats is at the same site very year. The AMA staff work on the site. The AMA staff do not have to deal with different groups running the events on different sites. The AMA staff know all of the local suppliers of goods and services.

Chad, it is not realistic or even sensible to think that the MAAC staff could do the same. How would MAAC staff based in Burlington organise the event if it was held in B.C.? Remember, when we enter the US Nats we just show up and fly. We do not lift a finger to work. Come back down to earth and understand that a huge volunteer and full time staff effort has taken place to provide this. What does MAAC have, 2 1/2 full time employees? Get real.

Ed S

Sharpy01

My Feedback: (12)

........yes Chad, it's of little interest to you because it is simply about...................you. []

Chad, you fly toy airplanes and whether it's fact or fiction, you depict an image of a spoiled brat who stands about with your feathers fanned out from your JR embroidered golf shirt, judging and complaining, calling all those annoying little "details"........"no brainers". There is definately a "no brainer" here, but it doesn't involve port-a-potties.

Go fly in your toy airplane event wherever you please, collect you 5th consecutive 16th place finnish and have fun. PLease stop expecting everyone else to do all the "no brainer" (aka: hard and dirty) work for you so you only have to worry about that unknown sequence and don't mess up the shirt with sweat stains. Thanks.

can773

My Feedback: (1)

Without an attempt at it I guess one would never know.....I have seen volunteers do a lot more with a lot less.....let alone paid staff.

can773

My Feedback: (1)

LOL bite me.

Sharpy01

My Feedback: (12)

so Chad, your life experience has taught you that paid staff, none of whom have a toy airplane interest, are more motivated than volunteers who do so out of love for what they do?

......that my spoiled good man, is truley LOLable.

PS: a "reboot" would be more beneficial than a boot.

Apparenlty there is no "points" awarded for public relation abilities when handing out our national team spots? Might be a consideration for our "rules" folks. [sm=idea.gif]

reo

My Feedback: (130)

Chad, I don't think that the job descriptions for the girls in the office would include assisting in 'organizing' events. I would think that they have their hands full with the jobs at hand on a day to day basis without worrying about food, porta-potties, etc. Leave them to what they do best and efficiently.....the jobs they were hired for.

Ron Oscar

Sharpy01

My Feedback: (12)

.problem is, young Chad feels that pampering to his needs trumps all considerations.

can773

My Feedback: (1)

Whatever....

l8r

Jim_McIntyre

It's amazing how a simple thought can lead to such a nasty, mostly unrelated dialogue.

Many in this discussion (especially the more active ones) have brought up more pie-in-the-sky ideas than this...

Although I may be strolling through a minefield here, give it a chance. The issues around these events always seems to center around an audit trail. This is something that should be doable. If MAAC were to handle the money, paying bills as directed by this group, there would be no question of an audit trail. I don't think this work breakdown would be too arduous for MAAC staff.....

As for Marc's inference that many other events take place without this 'noise'. True but, lets not compare apples with meals ... Organising competition requires much more rigor than arranging for some hotdogs, pop and ice.

sam369

As a former maac competitor I am appalled by the attitude taken by my fellow MAAC competitors these days, do this for me, arrange this for me, pay this for me, don't ask me to account for this, maac is for me.

When a international representative of MAAC whose entry and ACC fees were paid by MAAC makes these type of statments I can see why there are problems in MAAC.

Just a sad era for maac!

Sharpy01

My Feedback: (12)

No Jim......................... the issues around these events seem to center around the same people. From what I've read on RCC, maybe it's been recognized and is being dealt with through democratic process. Guess we'll see what the board looks by the time the AGM rolls around.

can773

My Feedback: (1)

Your statements could not be further from the truth....I will be in Edmonton next weekend (17th) giving a presentation on electrics to the local clubs...along with another from the f3a team....

MAAC arranged nothing for us, and did not provide entry fees....all rules and policies are followed to the letter regarding the team.

Feel free to discuss this face to face post presentation...

Since you dont post who you are (anonymity of the internet is a great thing isnt it!) you will have to approach me...I wont hide.

Ed Smith

And Porta-Potties.

Exactly the point I was making in my post. MAAC does not have the resources to do this. Unfortunately there are "Prima Donnas" that do not understand this.

Ed S

Jim_McIntyre

I think that was meant for me ... [sm=confused.gif]

Just to set the record straight, MAAC (or the committee, more accurately) did pay my entry fee in 2002, a very nice gesture for which I am grateful. I paid my own ACC fee and I donated my travel expense cheque back to MAAC as a return gesture of gratitude.

Further, I'm not making any demands ... as I said, it was just a though on how to address what appears to me to be a recurring issue....

Y'know, something might actually be accomplished by these discussions if people (anonymous or otherwise) would stop coming out swinging....

can773

My Feedback: (1)

Committee chairs or appointed individuals run the events locally so the bulk of the daily work during the competition is done.....the organizing of awards can be done via phone from anywhere in the country....the office staff could organize volunteers in local areas to look after certain items that need local attention. The point of having the office staff look after such things is that they will know exactly what needs to be done year to year and can direct the locals on those needs.

Phone and email can get a lot accomplished, and a central core that knows the issues and whats needed to cover the administration of the event (not the actual disciplines) could be done from the office......our world today is small, you are basically at touch with the entire country through a keyboard and a phone line.

Sorry for having ideas that dont fall within the lines....but I guess doing it the traditional way (not having a Nats) is a better idea.

See ya in Muncie Ed.

can773

My Feedback: (1)

Whoever it was meant for sam can discuss his problems with two team members face to face next weekend if he so desires.

All I can tell you is that our entry fee (~$3000) and FAI license was paid for by the teams own fundraising.....in total we raised around $8000 in 6 months. All organized via email and telephone

reo

My Feedback: (130)

Chad, there is nothing wrong with new ideas but by the same token you should not be offended if some don't agree with those ideas, that said, ...... you and I both know that having the ladies in the MAAC office run a few of the errands (if their time allowed and they were willing) to source prizes, food vendors, biffies, etc would not save the Nats.....

Ron Oscar

can773

My Feedback: (1)

Those who disagree with intelligent arguments are worth talking to....those who simply attack the messenger because of their ideas are not.

Not at this point...but down the road it could go a long way to reducing the local learning curve of running such an event....more often than not the SIG's know exactly what is needed to run the event and that is usually not the issue but all the other "stuff" associated with the overall event....if a lot of that planning and knowledge base was central with the office staff I think it would be a lot easier to get a sucessful event off the ground...beyond that then MAAC is also in more control and the bull**** that occured with the '05 Nats could very likely be avoided.....

However....a few posts in cyberspace will change little so I will just go back to learning how to fly my helicopter.....maybe just to irritate Marc and Ken I will try out for the F3C team as well LOL

Besides its no difference for me to drive to Ontario or drive to Indiana for the US Nats....so being honest I would not likely attend a Nats in Ontario anyways as I would prefer to attend the US Nats.

Morison

The reality is that chad has a point.

The office could probably handle the added tasks of handling the registrations, collecting entrys and paying bills - thus keeping a handle on the overall budget. (That is how it worked for the glider worlds)

There ARE many things that could be handled from a distance, but probably many more that are best handled 'on the ground'

The experience has been that every new nats committee has to start from the ground up ... some continuity, even if it is reviewing a comperehensive budget from a previous event, would assist in identifying what needs to be addressed. Keeping the office staff in the loop is vital to long term longevity of any initiative.

For the record, MAAC funding of teams has always been based on travel costs and who goes where in a given year. Typically that has been most of the air fare to get to the destination country ... leaving all other expenses covered by the team. F3J Glider teams will now have team entry fees paid on top of that because of the surplus from the 2004 Worlds hosted in Red Deer.

Sharpy01

My Feedback: (12)

Chad. I don't care what you do, but to go after our paid staff on a public forum where they cannot/willnot participate is wrong. You were wrong and the attitude you dislplay, be it intentional or not, it what it is.

kenair

My Feedback: (10)

I'm not sure that was the best thing to do, perhaps the profits should have been shared.

1. the membership paid for the yearly acc fee so that maac is part of the fai.
2. the membership pays for the office salaries in maac who resources were used for this event.
3. the insurance umbrella that the event was run under was paid for maac.
4. the seed money ( if any) was provided by the maac membership.
5. if the event had gone the way of scale 2002 and incurred losses the membership would have paid for that.

If you are saying only the FAI glider teams are only sharing in those profits, then I think is it not fair to the membership of maac and perhaps that is where MAAC Nats 2005 got the idea to send the 2005 Nats profits to the CAC.

Jim_McIntyre

How very socialistic of you Ken, in other words, the sweat equuity of those who dare to get off their duffs should be spread equally to those who criticise from their duffs.[:@]