Red B.

After a couple of decades of flying all sorts of propeller aircraft I have finally decided to get into jets. I am considering purchasing a Jetcat P80 (gas start) that has been bench run for two hours, but not flown. I would appreciate any advice on how much I should expect to pay for such a turbine provided that all original accessories (ECU etcetera) are included.

Also, I have noticed that Jetcat has replaced the original P80 with the P80SE. Are there any significant differences between the two that motivates the purchase of a new P80SE instead of going the secondhand route?

Shok

My Feedback: (28)

The P80 although a great motor suffered from a very slow spool up time.

The new SE version cuts that spool time in almost half and also supplies a bit more thrust.

gruntled

I believe the SE has more thrust and significantly less throttle lag.

Oops - beat me to it.

madmodelman

I would not even bother with a non SE version, I have both and the SE is a different engine altogether, the spool up is significantly faster and the power noticably greater.

If you fly from a long runway you will get away with a P80 but if you are tight for space an overshoot decision for instance has to be made extremely early to save your model. Is it worth the risk?

FalconWings

My Feedback: (57)

Depends, you can get a really good deal on a P-80 for like $1500, and you will have an engine for life. It does come with the problem of throttle lag, but if you will be flying trainer type "floaters" like a Boomerang or a Jetmach..........then the throttle lag is not that big of a deal. I had one on a Bandit ARF and it was very decent.
Still, weather a P-80 or a P-80SE, it is still a 19lb P160 . Big, bulky, but very reliable.

Red B.

Thank you for some very useful information!

Of course, I will start out with a jet "trainer", but since I am a scale buff it will eventually end up in a SAAB J-29 "flying barrel".
I can live with 16 lbs of thrust as long as the turbine is reliable and has a long service life.

I have heard that the old P80 has a spool-up time of approximately 3s. and a slightly shorter spool-down time. Is that in agreement with your experiences?
What I will do is to take one of my old pattern ships and adjust the throttle servo speed to 3 seconds from idle to full throttle.
This will help me decide whether or not I can live with the slow spool-up/down time of the old P80.


Saab J-29

Selleri

The SE is 97N or about 22 lbs.

FalconWings

My Feedback: (57)

Yes, it is still a 22lbs P160.

Red, 3 seconds is about right. Now keep in mind there are ways around it. For example you can set your trim higher than normal where you are 20K RPM over normal idle. This cuts spool up time significantly if you had to, but you will have some residue thrust.

Carsten Groen

Absolutely NOT!
The two P80's (non SE) I have owned (bought them new, two years ago), had a spool up time of around 6..7 seconds from idle, and a little faster "the other way"
I had them in two Baby Boomerangs, sold both engines and mounted P60SE's instead, a world of difference (I would have bought the P80SE if they had been available at the time) for me at that time!

Selleri

Touché

JetCatJimmy

I haven't seen the SE's, but I personally own a P80. This is a great engine. There are numbers of people, including myself, that feel the spool up time is part and parcel to the jet experience. I think opinions are going to runt the gamut. I love my P80. I've never had problems with it and love the gas start. It is easy and doesn't take anywhere NEAR the juice of the kero-starts that come with the SE's.

In the future I will plan on sucking it up and going SE or to a similar turbine with a CNC machined compressor blade instead of a cast one for faster spool times, but don't ever let that dissuade you from choosing a great turbine at possibly an incredible deal!

bigbri

My Feedback: (287)

love my p-80. got it on a Roo......7 seconds from idle is about right...keep it about 20% on final and if you have to go around spoolup time is about 4 seconds

JetCatJimmy

With mine, if I move the throttle just a couple clicks from idle it has enough residual thrust to maintain a nice descent and you're right - it'll make spool up much easier if you're not resting near 35,000rpm.

Guillermo Ibanez

My Feedback: (1)

My P-80 is one year old and has the new chip inside and spool time is 3 sec.

I remember older turbines spool time about 6-7 sec.

rhklenke

My Feedback: (24)

Why the heck would you bench run a turbine for two hours?!? Man, that's a heck of a lot of "look at what I bought!" to get two hours of run time!

Bob

JetCatJimmy

I have to agree with the 3 second spool time on the older P80. Mine is about two years old and 7 seconds just doesn't sound right by me. I come in at idle and throw the stick up for a go-around and it doesn't take anywhere near 7 seconds to reach maximum. Not sure what the actual time is, but I would swear around 3-4.

KC36330

I've seen allot of old non SE P-80s over the years and 7+ seconds is the normal for spool times (from idle to noticeable thrust was over 3 seconds), not allot slower then a P-70 or non SE 120s and 160s. if the price was right thought i wouldn't have a problem buying a non SE P-80, if the price wasn't that great a savings I'd just go with a new SE version.

JetCatJimmy

I think KC makes a good point. I would most likely base my decision on the spread between the two prices. If it wasn't that great of a deal for the older model, why not get a brand spankin' new SE. The transition from props to jets would be much smoother there.

FalconWings

My Feedback: (57)

Mine was a non SE with a serial number of ~ 1200 (pretty old). Although it had a slow spool, I could never say it was 6-7 seconds..........maybe I was lucky but that sounds too slow.

JetCatJimmy

I just timed the flight with the go-around I was referencing on YT. It was 4 seconds to max thrust.

Shok

My Feedback: (28)

The prices on the P-80SE are really good considering it's a 22lb thrust motor.

Excellent value and probably not far off what you would be paying for something used and non SE

The Great Squintini

P-80, the absolute best and most reliable engine on the market. You can't go wrong with either one. I have both..... As far as spool up time.. it never really bothered me, as a matter of fact slower spool ups are more realistic of the full scale aircraft and require more situational awareness and skill to master them.

BaldEagel

Get hold of the turbine No and then look on the JetCat forum to see if the one on offer is able to be upgraded to the SE version, cost about £300.00, if its not able to be upgraded then its the old version (prior to Dec 2008) and will have a spool up time of about 6 seconds, this is fine if you fly from a good runway and have lots of room, but if you fly from a small field it can be a problem on a go around if you don't make the decision early enough, the best habit you can get into is not to close the throttle lower than the first third then the spool up time is reduced considerably.

Latest 80SE is a completly different kettle of fish, spool up time is considerably reduced about the same responce as a 50cc petrol engine, the SE is also quiter which can be a bonus on a noise sensitive site.

Mike

BaldEagel

So do cross ply tyres, but I don't use them anymore.

Mike

Old Claw

My Feedback: (1)

I for one think the only consideration is the price of the engine. Even if they were both P80 SE's, if one is second hand then it's only worth buying if there's a considerable saving. Example. Warranty on new is available, whereas on the used jet there isn't any. I know the P80 is a strong, reliable motor but it is second hand. It will run just as well for you as an SE BUT, as you are just starting out in turbines I can assure you that in 12 months you'll be looking for a bigger jet. Go the cheap route now and you'll lose a whole lot less when you sell it. Good luck, Very old, nearly dead Cliff